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Yep, that's me too.I tend to surfski 3x -4x per week, that's 8 hours tops, typ more like 5.
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Hahaha, yeah, that resonates so much with me!If I had had to do 80/20 or MAF I really cannot believe I would be where I am plus I would have given up of boredom long ago.
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robin.mousley wrote: I do have another consideration though and that is that I seem to be injuring myself more frequently of late. I haven't two lots of intercostal muscle tears and I did something similar just this last weekend.
Anyway - for the sake of trying to improve my downwind technique I'm going to focus on keeping my HR down on at least some of the downwinds and see where that takes me. "Extending the glide" is my aim! If that keeps my HR down as well, so much the better.
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mrcharly wrote: If you are training to race, there is another factor; training to suffer.
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robin.mousley wrote:
Anyone out there do 80/20 training? What heart rate do you aim at for the low intensity stuff?
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mrcharly wrote: gearmuncher, that makes a lot of sense.
We should also take into account all exercise; I get limited time on the water, however I also cycle to work. This is about 45min each way, 5 days a week. Low intensity.
All in I guess my training (exercise is):
7.5 hours a week low intensity
1.5hr gym (50% time high-intensity working on hand crank machine)
4-5hrs paddling. 2/3rds of the time spent actually on the water is doing intervals or sprints.
I suggest that isn't atypical; quite a few paddlers mix in a bit of jogging and cycling, some gym sessions. Maybe 50/50 rather than 80/20.
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uk gearmuncher wrote: Finally, contrary to what Seiler says, there is no published evidence (and I mean NONE) that downscaling the concept for amateurs works. If you only train for 5 hours per week for example, he has claimed that 80/20 is still the best way to go but the volume of that is so low to be useless if you do that in my view. Likewise, that shunts the only opportunity for physiological performance progression mainly onto really pushing the intensity in that one session which is, frankly, not mentally sustainable in the long run. Couple this with evidence that has been published that higher intensity sessions such as Vo2 max development can max out in 6-8 weeks and you'll suddenly find you have a problem.
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Damnation.I typed a whole bunch of links up but posting my message resulted in "Your message has been considered spam" from surfski.info. I don't have energy now to rewrite the whole thing
. (Hey Rob, if at least the response repeated the message I could figure out how to chop it so it gets accepted...
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I like the Strongfirst principles:
From all the responses, it seems to me that I'd need to train a lot more often and with a lot more intent to gain any benefit from prioritising MAF.Don't train, but practice (learn the skill!)
Train almost daily
Finish your training sessions feeling refreshed and energised with something in the tank for tomorrow.
Go hard only occasionally - when testing yourself or peaking for an event.
Practice and learn the skills and the stength and fitness will come along with it.
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robin.mousley wrote:
I like the Strongfirst principles:
From all the responses, it seems to me that I'd need to train a lot more often and with a lot more intent to gain any benefit from prioritising MAF.Don't train, but practice (learn the skill!)
Train almost daily
Finish your training sessions feeling refreshed and energised with something in the tank for tomorrow.
Go hard only occasionally - when testing yourself or peaking for an event.
Practice and learn the skills and the stength and fitness will come along with it.
But... it seems much more likely that I'll improve by going less hard, and focussing on skills.
After all, my goal is to keep beating my Miller's Run PB. Doing better at flat-water racing is not a high priority for me.
More often than not, the conditions prevailing on the Miller's Run are not PB conditions in any case - so what's the point of going flat out? Much rather go more deliberately and do the 50 stroke challenge (how far can you get in 50 strokes) and other drills and then when the wind and waves are optimal, go flat out.
This was highlighted for me yesterday when I paddled on the back of a double with Oscar Chalupsky. I've had the privilege and pleasure of doing this half a dozen times now, and every time it's the same - I end up gobsmacked at the skill and precision efforts and the low average heart rate. The big O is a total magician on the runs.
(He's going a little slower now - chemo means he's not allowed to put too much effort in - but he's in good shape and good heart otherwise.)
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Spot on Manta. Kelly Starrett has also published Waterman 2.0: Optimized Movement For Lifelong, Pain-Free Paddling And Surfing. I haven't bought a copy (yet) but believe it be similar to the Supple Leopard, just with a water sport slant based on his attempt at Molokai. Also look at www.flexiblesteel.com.manta wrote:
Prioritise mobility training and mobility related strength. What I mean by that is we need to make sure we stay flexible but strong as we age. There is a book called the Supple Leopard by Kelly Starrett. It is a lifesaver. He provides tests for mobility in the body and then simple at home mobility drills to fix the imbalances.
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