epic 18 x or v8 speeds

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9 months 3 weeks ago #40583 by Rickydee
i read the epic boat speeds chart for intermediate paddlers but is there actually guys out there that can really paddle a v8 at over 11.6 kmph for almost a hr paddle and not assisted by wind ?

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9 months 3 weeks ago #40584 by waverider
Replied by waverider on topic epic 18 x or v8 speeds
I read that as 11.3kmh for the V8. Thats my best 10km flat water circuit race pace in a v10g3 and I'm div 4/5 in my states comps, So a div 2 or 3 paddler should be able to do that in a V8. Intermediate is a big bracket. It would take good fitness to sustain high speed in a V8 but it is certainly capable of reaching higher speeds than that

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9 months 3 weeks ago #40585 by Rickydee
Replied by Rickydee on topic epic 18 x or v8 speeds
yes correct it is 11.3kmph for the V8 intermediate paddlers thanks for the feed back , i did not know they had different categories of paddlers that is great for the sport for sure i thought they just had boat classes

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9 months 3 weeks ago #40588 by waverider
Replied by waverider on topic epic 18 x or v8 speeds

yes correct it is 11.3kmph for the V8 intermediate paddlers thanks for the feed back , i did not know they had different categories of paddlers that is great for the sport for sure i thought they just had boat classes

Depends were you race i guess, Here in Australia some races are age and gender groups. Some are performance divisional classes. Flatwater comps are often different to open water/ski comps. Either way Greg Bartons standard for "intermediate" is at the upper end of intermediate.

I also have the ICF Legacy K1 as well as a V10 G3 and can confirm what he says that the k1 will likely be slower for intermediate paddlers, its the paddlers ability that holds you back. May goal is to actually be fater in the K1 than the v10, getting closer but not there yet. Similarly at the lower level of intermediate a V8 may well be faster than a V10 for some. The extra stability means you can slot it into race pace and effectively switch on cruise control, start day dreaming, and still not miss a beat, especially if you can jump a wash ride, or if there are any bumps about. In a tippier boat the rotation and leg drive falls off a bit, throw in slightly shorter catches and a few hesitations and speed drops away substantially, its more mentally draining sustaining it over a longer distance.

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9 months 3 weeks ago #40589 by mrcharly
Replied by mrcharly on topic epic 18 x or v8 speeds
My racing experience is entirely in K1 (div 5).
I agree with everything Waverider has said.
The stability ratings of K1s go from 8 to 1 (there are some boats that with a rotating seat should be a 0).

There is very little difference in speed between, say stab 6 and stab 4. For a given paddler, they'll be able to paddle the stab 6 boat at say 10kph, and the stab 4 boat at 10.2kph. That would result in a huge winning margin over a standard race, over a minute.

*however*; not capsizing, being able to sustain efficient stroke, faster portages and reduced stress from worrying about capsizes will save more than a minute. Racing can get a bit pushy, I've only been in one race where I didn't get bumped, shoved or be unable to paddle because someone's nose was under where I needed to place my blade!

Stable is fast. All the experts say it.

They paddle super skinny boats because, for them, those boats are stable.

And even then they can muck up. Ivan is a beast of a paddler with decades of experience; he nearly didn't make it on a scottish race because he used his less stable boat.

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9 months 3 weeks ago #40590 by Rickydee
Replied by Rickydee on topic epic 18 x or v8 speeds
Thanks guys i been looking for a used or damaged K1 but that's probably out of my league how much does the weight of the paddler affect speed ? i was i a race and as we went under a bridge and someone took a picture and my wake was massive made it look like the other boat was not moving but we were going the same speed , just wondering is there big men over 200 lbs in the pro series or in competitive classes

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9 months 3 weeks ago - 9 months 3 weeks ago #40591 by mrcharly
Replied by mrcharly on topic epic 18 x or v8 speeds
Someone who is heavy will throw a bigger wake, that is unavoidable. You are displacing more water.
It is important to match the boat to weight - I once got in a Marspot Eta, weight limit 70kg. I was about 85kg at the time, and the boat nearly sank. It also didn't have any stability.
Second hand K1s are cheap. I bought an old (diamond) design boat that had been built for someone who went on to compete at an international level, paid £300 for it. That was an 8kg kevlar boat.
Look for something that wasn't made by Nelo - they are overpriced on the 2nd hand market.
Sprinters tend to be heavier.
Marathon/distance paddlers range hugely, but mostly people get lean. I went from 85kg down to 72kg, without dieting, when I was racing. Not too bad for a bloke in his 50s. A friend, Pete is about 95kg, so over 200lb, but he is a tall bloke.
It is hard to compare stability between K1 and ski. My Nelo 510 I'd say is about a stab9/10. 'beginner' K1s like a Hobby are an 8. If you haven't paddled a K1, look for something about stab 5 or 6, certainly not more wobbly than that.
DON'T buy a boat unless you can test paddle it, or have paddled the same model.
Last edit: 9 months 3 weeks ago by mrcharly.

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9 months 3 weeks ago #40592 by waverider
Replied by waverider on topic epic 18 x or v8 speeds

Thanks guys i been looking for a used or damaged K1 but that's probably out of my league how much does the weight of the paddler affect speed ? i was i a race and as we went under a bridge and someone took a picture and my wake was massive made it look like the other boat was not moving but we were going the same speed , just wondering is there big men over 200 lbs in the pro series or in competitive classes

Fast guys in all sizes. Skis are better for heavier Paddlers as k1s, especially the skinnier ICF ones, tend to have low volume, so you would be looking for an XXL model. That said it is huge step in stability from V8 to a ICF K1. Volume is a factor of both width, length and depth of hull. With ICF K1s the higher volume boats often just have a deeper hull as they are 5.2m long as standard and ICF boats try to be as close to 40cm wide as possible to meet race regs. No regs on skis so they can be any dimension. They naturally have more volume to deal with open water conditions

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9 months 5 days ago #40607 by epic5253
Replied by epic5253 on topic epic 18 x or v8 speeds
i've got a 2006 18x and did a 54:06 on a 9.8km oval flatwater circuit in March this year.
yes, i actually did 16x laps of about 612m... that's only 10.87km/h avg.
About the gen 1 V8, i believe that's based on the 18x hull, but I'm pretty sure the gen 2 had hull improvements which made it a couple of cms narrower as well as the improved bailer and carry handles..

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