Describe your ideal (as yet unbuilt) ski.

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8 years 4 days ago #21900 by spidennis

Newbflat wrote:

spidennis wrote: Hatches, I want some freakin' hatches, forward and rear. Yeah, there's a few skis out there but they are mostly based on the box rule of 18 foot kayaks and I want something faster. I want to be able to go a few days unsupported in a surf ski and not in a kayak. camping gear, water, food …… and the speed of a real surf ski. Is this too much to ask?

oh yeah, a mount for a white navigation light behind me, on a pole, over my head. I paddle at night a lot! or very early in the mornings .


Maybe it's time to go to Sweden!
www.nordickayaks.se/en/breeze.php


How do you like the s18s and SR?

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8 years 3 days ago #21906 by Newbflat
As for the SR and S18s... I like them both. The SR is nearly as stable as the S18s but is missing some of the endless secondary of the S18s.
The SR is definitely faster and surfs well down wind. Its very fast for me is side chop or really messy water. Up wind is not its forte as it's very full in the ends and doesn't part the water as effortlessly as my V10. I suspect in rough water and side chop I'm still faster in the SR than my V10. The one fault of both the Stellar's is bailing speed. With the size of the buckets there is no excuse for the slow bailing. My S18s came with a poorly places bullet and bails ridiculously slow. Both skis will be retrofitted with anderson bailers this winter like they should come with in the first place. I went paddling with a friend the other day. He was in my s18s and I paddled the V10. We just spent a couple of hours catching boat wakes and goofing around. This was only his second time in a ski but he has solid whitewater skills so he doesn't fall out.
He had a lot of fun and frankly had better rides than I did. An 18 foot highly rockers boat is just a better choice on small boat wakes than 21+ feet of ski with little rocker like the V10. It's so much more maneuverable than the V10 and parks nicely on short steep waves. The S18s is a much more fun boat to go for more of a relaxed paddle or long day out. It is an honest touring boat and is a champ when it's rough out, on boat wakes and is a pice of cake to remount. I have no Idea if it's a better boat down wind than a V8, Eze/big Eze, Bluefin or any other beginner ski... But none of those tour. It is also truly destined to tour as it has added freeboard to carry a load so isn't just a ski with hatches, it carries weight. Honestly, if I had to choose and only have one kayak or ski.... (the horror!)... It would be the S18s. I love my V10 and paddle it almost all the time, but the S18s is such a jack of all trades and good at all of them, it easily wins on points.

The Breeze looks sweet but it's not available in the US. If it was I suspect that would be my choice.

Bill

FENN Bluefin S
FENN Swordfish S carbon hybrid
Epic V8 double gen 2
Lot and lots of DK rudders.


Had:
Stellar SEL excel (gen 2)
Stellar SR excel (gen2)
Stellar S18s g1 (excel)
Epic V10 Double (performance)
Stellar SR (gen 1)
V10 sport (gen 2)
V10 (Gen 2)
Beater SEL (gen 1)

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8 years 2 days ago #21917 by spidennis

Newbflat wrote: As for the SR and S18s...

Honestly, if I had to choose and only have one kayak or ski.... (the horror!)... It would be the S18s. I love my V10 and paddle it almost all the time, but the S18s is such a jack of all trades and good at all of them, it easily wins on points.

The Breeze looks sweet but it's not available in the US. If it was I suspect that would be my choice.

Bill


thank you for your report! The Breeze would be my choice too but ….. seems like one boat can't really do it all huh? but that Breeze would be close! Choices, Choices …….. I want to do the Texas Water Safari and was thinking about using the S18S, plus it would make a great all around boat for my home waters here at South Padre Island, Texas. It would also be a great introductory ride for my friends down here. Fast, Stable, and easy to remount, a boat like this could really open up some eyes to kayaking, especially with the sup craze going on. ……. but then there is always that quest for speed ……. and I miss the raw speed of a true surf ski! but for now my cargo hauling CD Extreme will have to do.

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8 years 2 days ago #21920 by Newbflat
Be aware that the S18s comes with odd/ restricting bulkhead placement. The stern bulkhead is placed just ahead of the "S" in Stellar on the back deck and at the S in "S18s" on the bow. The boat is all ready low volume in comparison to a sea kayak so if maximum storage is Important then you might ask for no bulkheads or custom bulkhead placement. I did this and had mixed success.

After telling them what I wanted ( bulkhead just in front of the rudder box and just behind the handle in the bow) and getting a confirmation picture from them with arrows in the right places, the boat came with the stern bulkhead behind the rudder box, a useless location. Stellar said they would "make it right" and had me take it to a rowing shell maker for repair work. Even after I told them (stellar) exactly where I wanted it again, it was installed in the standard location at the S in "Stellar".. They also would not address the very poor bailing caused buy a clearly poorly located bullet behind the venturi. It was up to me to grind it off and add a new bullet..... Very irritating. There pleading for me to accept delivery of a ski that was not correct with the promise of "making it right" was not kept. While I like the ski ( bailing not included) I'm not happy with the service I got from Stellar. I can accept the misplaced bulkhead the first time but I was basically told after the second time it was misplaced that that was it.. Done, and the bailer is fine. The bailer is not fine and the bulkhead is still I the wrong place! Also none of the work would have been done if I didn't bug them over two months to tell me where to take it. It took something like three months to get done.

Just a heads up if you ask for something custom.

Bill

FENN Bluefin S
FENN Swordfish S carbon hybrid
Epic V8 double gen 2
Lot and lots of DK rudders.


Had:
Stellar SEL excel (gen 2)
Stellar SR excel (gen2)
Stellar S18s g1 (excel)
Epic V10 Double (performance)
Stellar SR (gen 1)
V10 sport (gen 2)
V10 (Gen 2)
Beater SEL (gen 1)
The following user(s) said Thank You: Spacehopper

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8 years 2 days ago #21921 by spidennis
noted! I did not know about the bulkhead placements ……I was wondering about how much actual room there was in there.

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8 years 2 days ago #21922 by Sandy
you want something custom (bulkheads , hatches , etc.) in the US , call Huki , they will tell you exactly what they can/will do and they will execute properly and stand behind the work.

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8 years 2 days ago #21924 by Newbflat

Sandy wrote: you want something custom (bulkheads , hatches , etc.) in the US , call Huki , they will tell you exactly what they can/will do and they will execute properly and stand behind the work.



And when they make a true touring ski I will.

Bill

FENN Bluefin S
FENN Swordfish S carbon hybrid
Epic V8 double gen 2
Lot and lots of DK rudders.


Had:
Stellar SEL excel (gen 2)
Stellar SR excel (gen2)
Stellar S18s g1 (excel)
Epic V10 Double (performance)
Stellar SR (gen 1)
V10 sport (gen 2)
V10 (Gen 2)
Beater SEL (gen 1)

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8 years 2 days ago #21925 by spidennis
they did a custom ski for Carter Johnson for the Everglades Challenge (EC300) that I tried to buy off of him but decided to keep it for his collection. He also did the Texas Water Safari with another custom boat ….. yeah, wish they were a little more off the shelf models.

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8 years 2 days ago #21926 by spidennis
Another thing I want in a surf ski would be a better rudder system. I have been doing the Adirondack Canoe Classic for a handful of years now and in the past a few skis were entered and I'd like to enter one at some point soon. The problem is the weeds and beaver dams causing problems with the rudder system.

What I'd like to have is both the under stern and over stern systems in place but have the under stern rudder kick up into the hull and out of the way for when the beaver dams are run or when weeds are plentiful, and then the over stern would come into play.

In this past running of the ADK90 I had a friend in a sea kayak and his rudder broke off just before the infamous "Browns Track" but he was able to edge his boat to make the tight turns. A ski doesn't "edge" so rudders are necessary! I want both operational.

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8 years 2 days ago #21927 by ErikE

Marieski wrote: [...] a subtle recess in the gunwales for grasping with cold tired slippery fingers would be great.


+10 to that! (recently got some nasty looking damage on my v14 when it slipped out of my hand and dropped on the ground.)

Other than that: Like the v14 but:
- a few dm shorter.
- with a footplate which is slightly longer than the standard footplate (but shorter than the long footplate), and with it's fastening point a bit higher up
- more straps on aft deck, so that a spare paddle could be carried easily
- a mount point for a compass on foredeck (in case of fog)

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8 years 1 day ago #21929 by coastbouy
Yes wouldn't be great if you could have one boat that would do it all?

by the time you have built the ultimate touring surf ski( bulkheads hatches, built heavy duty, a little wider for stability) you would end up with a with a 50+ lbs. boat...because that is what composite touring kayaks weigh that are 18+ ft. long

What really would be nice if the folks that built composite touring took some design clues from surf skis...I think there are few out there...PT. 65 North, Epic, Rock Pool are three that I can think of

what Love about Surfskis....light,fast....fun!

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8 years 1 day ago #21931 by goofish
Fun thread. Of course there is no one ski that is going to be perfect for everything, but I wonder if anybody has built the perfect ski for short period wind waves (like one would find on a large lake or a bay with enough fetch to generate such waves). Not something that would necessarily be the fastest thing on the water, but the one that was built to be most fun to surf. I imagine that it would be a bit shorter than the average ski, and maybe a bit flatter on the bottom, like a surfboard. Hard chine like the Think Legend? Still fast enough to pick up new waves though.

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8 years 1 day ago #21933 by Spacehopper

coastbouy wrote: What really would be nice if the folks that built composite touring took some design clues from surf skis...I think there are few out there...PT. 65 North, Epic, Rock Pool are three that I can think of

what Love about Surfskis....light,fast....fun!


Indeed, my eyes popped out when I saw how much some of the carbon/kevlar Rockpool boats were compared to skis, and for what appears to be a much more basic build.

That said, maybe a single hatch mandated for entry level skis to make them a bit more multipurpose might encourage some creative solutions and give more people an excuse to buy into the sport.

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8 years 1 day ago #21954 by Newbflat

coastbouy wrote: Yes wouldn't be great if you could have one boat that would do it all?

by the time you have built the ultimate touring surf ski( bulkheads hatches, built heavy duty, a little wider for stability) you would end up with a with a 50+ lbs. boat...because that is what composite touring kayaks weigh that are 18+ ft. long

What really would be nice if the folks that built composite touring took some design clues from surf skis...I think there are few out there...PT. 65 North, Epic, Rock Pool are three that I can think of

what Love about Surfskis....light,fast....fun!


My S18s fits that, more or less. While maybe not "heavy duty" the advantage lay up is reasonably tough. It weighs 36 lbs. I would like a 50lbs solid layup version though (no coring) . Something I could drag across barnacle covered rocks without worrying about going threw the skin. A true touring layup, thick and tough. If I'm touring in it an extra 15-20lbs doesn't matter, but a tough bullet proof bottom does.

Bill

FENN Bluefin S
FENN Swordfish S carbon hybrid
Epic V8 double gen 2
Lot and lots of DK rudders.


Had:
Stellar SEL excel (gen 2)
Stellar SR excel (gen2)
Stellar S18s g1 (excel)
Epic V10 Double (performance)
Stellar SR (gen 1)
V10 sport (gen 2)
V10 (Gen 2)
Beater SEL (gen 1)

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7 years 11 months ago #22060 by uk_exile
More pics of the combo K1 ski here. Shows foot plate, bailer, etc
www.trademe.co.nz/a.aspx?id=787660400
The following user(s) said Thank You: ErikE

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7 years 11 months ago #22071 by rlh608
Anybody ever build a 'ski with a transom, or a bobbed tail like an IC sailing canoe? Strikes me that extra buoyancy at the stern might be a good thing, help lift the ski onto a wave.

Current ski: Stellar SR Advantage

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7 years 11 months ago #22074 by ErikE

rlh608 wrote: Anybody ever build a 'ski with a transom, or a bobbed tail like an IC sailing canoe? Strikes me that extra buoyancy at the stern might be a good thing, help lift the ski onto a wave.


Not a ski, but still interesting: www.guillemot-kayaks.com/guillemot/kayak/other/aleutesque
The following user(s) said Thank You: rlh608

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7 years 11 months ago #22075 by UnnamedCoward
I am looking to build one of these things. I just need to convince the wife that I need a new boat.

www.thomassondesign.com/en/catalog/my-kayaks/sea-racer

With the following modifications to make it more interesting.
www.facebook.com/roar.berge.1/media_set?...0001495008224&type=3

Josh

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