how do you rotate in a surf ski?

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10 years 2 months ago #14162 by wintermutt
i have paddled kayaks since 1994. i acquired a used carbon mako 6 (which fits my behind!!) and i love the ski for about 2 miles then my arms give out because i am not rotating. i am used to paddling a kayak, and i do a lot of rotation and leg drive in a kayak, but i cannot figure out how to rotate in the mako 6. the hump under my knees feels good (kind of like spooning in bed with my wife) but since i cannot straighten my knee i cannot rotate like i normally do.
since there are a lot of vary fast surf skiers who kick my butt in local races when i am in my kayak i know there is something i have not learned yet.
any thoughts?
thank you.

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10 years 2 months ago #14163 by rubberDuck
You have to set up your footplate so that you can fit your fist under both your knees. That should allow you then sufficient rotation. Not as much as for a K1, but still enough I guess.
The following user(s) said Thank You: wintermutt

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10 years 2 months ago #14165 by wintermutt

rubberDuck wrote: You have to set up your footplate so that you can fit your fist under both your knees. That should allow you then sufficient rotation. Not as much as for a K1, but still enough I guess.


i thought i had one fist distance but i probably measured it wrong.
i will measure again. pushing with my heel also felt a little odd, but it felt good at the same time. how come all the skis have that hump under the knees? does it aid flotation, keep the water out?
seems to me the more rotation, the better the leg drive, the faster you go.

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10 years 2 months ago #14166 by Zephyrus
I wonder what would happen if the hump were replaced with a semi inflated water tight bag.

That way your legs could "displace" the air in the bag, and you would have full range of motion.

I think the main benefit of the hump is lowering the amount of space in the cockpit for water to fill. I think the semi inflated bag might allow even less space for water, completely filling the gap between your knees and the hull at all times.


If that doesn't work, maybe skis could have a "no hump" option, and the gap could be filled with foam.

A paddler could customize the foam shape to his/her legs, and even have different "foam humps" for different conditions. Put in the big hump for big water, medium in chop, and non in the flats!

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10 years 2 months ago #14169 by Ric
The hump keeps the water out... water weighs, so slows you down.

Also a difference to K1 in the leg drive is related to the extra balance needed in surfski conditions. In my opinion (i.e. flame me if you want) rougher conditions are not conducive to huge leg drive.

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10 years 2 months ago - 10 years 2 months ago #14171 by Kayaker Greg
Different ski's have different height and placement humps and they don't all fit everybody. I think the majority are fine for taller paddlers but not so good if your average height or short. I struggled with the height of the hump in my V10l and had to sell that ski because of it. My SES which is made for smaller paddlers was perfect. My SEL had a hump further forward and higher as its made for larger paddlers, however I made it work by building a seat that lifted and shifted myself further forward. I'm average height, 5'8".

With the rotation, make sure that you can pull the opposite leg forward and swing the torso from side to side, ski tips slightly to the drive side to offset the torso movement and don't focus on jamming the hips into the back of the bucket, hips should move a little forward and back, a little more length on the footplates helps to achieve this.
Last edit: 10 years 2 months ago by Kayaker Greg.

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10 years 2 months ago #14258 by wintermutt

rubberDuck wrote: You have to set up your footplate so that you can fit your fist under both your knees. That should allow you then sufficient rotation. Not as much as for a K1, but still enough I guess.


it worked. i moved the footplate about an inch closer to the seat.
stability was about the same. i went much farther and faster.

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10 years 2 months ago #14260 by Boof Head
The hump also adds structural reinforcement. Skis would be even more fragile without one.

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10 years 2 months ago #14262 by Zephyrus
I thought the light skis were mainly vulnerably to point impacts (with hard objects like rocks).

Could a ski could be made just as strong without a hump? Does the hump add to the overall structural stability? Or does it protect the floor of the cockpit from elbows knees and heels during re-entry?


I wonder if customizable/swappable foam humps might be ideal

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10 years 2 months ago #14264 by Boof Head
A ski could be made without a hump but would need beefing up along the edge of the cockpit to avoid "oil canning" Eg, gunwhales on a canoe.
I have built my own timber surfski and firmly believe that the hump contributes to structural integrity

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10 years 2 months ago #14269 by wesley
My Nelo Vintage Surfski has almost no hump. I will be posting review in few weeks. You actually could call it a "bump" it is so small. You can literally stretch your legs out completely and due to the angle of back of cockpit,you can lay your back on the deck!

Wesley Echols
SurfskiRacing.com
#1 in Surfski Reviews.

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10 years 2 months ago #14270 by smilicus
Boof Head - Any pictures of your timber Surfski?

Regards

Smilicus
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Everyday's an Adventure

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10 years 2 months ago #14272 by Boof Head
Not really. I have some progress pics on youtube. Do a search for BoofHead65.
I'll post some pcs when I finally get it varnished. Maybe December.
Cheers

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10 years 2 months ago #14274 by wintermutt
i would think raising the seat would make the effect of the hump less, but might raise other issues.

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