surfski choice?!far away from internationnal roots scene

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17 years 4 months ago #130 by fab64
I m a poor French paddler really far away from internationnal scene, I actually own a MAKO for around years and I plan to buy a new surfski...
My heart balance between...OF COURSE...Fenn6 and V10 (carbon versions)
but in france impossible to get on each boat and test buy my self...
Regarding the "surfski shoot out ", others articles and discussions,Speeds and stabilities specs look very close...
SO, is somebody who had be "lucky" to test those two boats could tell me more about different abbilities like:
-paddling in bumpy conditions...
-Ocean swells riding...(I hear that V10 nose get tendance to bang in the dips???)
-Front wind paddling
-Reactivity (I hear that Fenn6 was less responsive??)
-Or simply other different feelings or perceptions...
Thank you everybody

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  • robuser
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17 years 4 months ago #131 by robuser
Hey Fabien, I'm surprised you haven' t had more replies!
The boats are similar as you say.

I think you would be happy with either boat but perhaps you should also take into consideration:
- service (is there an Epic dealer in Biarritz?)
- availability - which company will deliver a boat, quicker?

If you are heavier than 90kg, a V10 might be better, if lighter then V10L/Mako6.

The V10 will be about 2kg lighter than the Mako6.

They are both beautiful skis.

Here's an idea - come to Cape Town and you can try both skis...!

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17 years 4 months ago #132 by AlanC
Bonjour Fabien!

FRANCAIS ICI [glow=red,2,300]ENGLISH BELOW[/glow]

J'ai utilis? les deux skis pendant les derri?res 12 mois, alors je peux te d?crire un peu de mes exp?riences personnels comme rameur et entraineur de kayaks et ski.

Premi?rement, je viens du kayak de vitesse, mais physiologiquement je suis un athl?te de longues distances.

Au d?but de mes exp?riences avec le surfski, j?empruntai des ski diverses aux alentours. Plus r?cemment, les deux ann?es derni?res j?avais une Fenn Mako Millennium et je l?adorai. C??tait vite sur le plat et un d?fi dan l?eau ? vive ?. Ici, l?eau ? vive ? est au maximum 1,0 ? 1,5 m haut et seulement 7-10 m entre les vagues, alors assez ? pic.

Les premiers skis de la ? nouvelle g?n?ration ? ici ? Vancouver ?taient les V10, et tout a coup il y avait tout une foule de rameurs du milieu de peloton sur mes talons! La stabilit? extra adscrite au V10 transf?rait directement dans la vitesse sur l?eau plate et de moyen relief.

Pendant l?hiver de 2006 j?ai emprunt? une V10 pour 3 semaines et c??tait ?vident imm?diatement que le ski ?tait plus stable et plus facile a ramer. Sur les bosses et vagues ou normalement j?aurai du ralentir un peu, c??tait facile a maintenir la vitesse et m?me forcer un peu plus. Le confort ?tait beaucoup mieux aussi. Avec le V10 mon seule concerne c??tait qu?entre 12 et 14 km/h ca me prenait plus d?effort dans les conditions lisse, et pour moi ici c??tait des conditions assez commun que je ne pouvais pas ignorer le fait. Mais, ca dit l??t? de 2006 a vu que des V10 et plusieurs Huki S1-X mener les courses, et seulement moi et une autre coureur de kayak vitesse sur le Millennium!

Apr?s plusieurs mois de recherche et questions j?ai d?cid? sur le Fenn Mako 6. Au fin, je dirait que le Mako 6 et le V10 sont tr?s semblables. La position de calle pour les pieds est superbe; t?es capable de pousser bien avec les jambes comme base pour la rotation. La balance est beaucoup mieux dans le V10 que le Mako 6, mais les deux sont mieux que le Millennium. Si t?as l?exp?rience en kayak FIC de vitesse ou marathon, t?auras pas de probl?mes avec le Mako 6. A vitesse sub-maximal (<12 km/h) les deux sont id?al, entre 12-14 sur l?eau lisse j?aime le Mako 6. Dans les grandes vagues? aucune id?e!

Le Mako 6 contre le Millennium; sup?rieur en toutes mani?res. Je pense que le Mako 6 glisse mieux entre coup de rame, sa vitesse maximal est sup?rieur a cause de la position des pieds et c?est superbe dans le surf. Pour les premi?res trois semaines dans le Mako 6, j?ai r?ussi plus de surfing (num?ros de vagues r?ussi et vitesses moyennes et maximales) que dans mes deux ans avec le Millennium!

J?esp?re que tout cela t?aide un peu. Au fond, guarder en tete que ce sont mes experiences dans l'eau chez nous. Premierement, j?irai avec celle qui es le plus disponible chez toi.

Alan

[glow=red,2,300]ENGLISH[/glow]

I've used both the V10 and Mako 6 in the past season and raced both, so I can tell you about my personal experiences in this debate.

First my background and where I use the ski. I have an ICF flatwater sprint kayak background but I am much more of an endurance athlete than sprint distance specialist. The water where I paddle most of the time is mostly wind chop with tiny ground swells if any at all. Maximum wave height is 1.0-1.5 m with a 7-10 m wave length, average days are less than half to a third of that. And the water is cold!

I began my surfski career borrowing different boats and using whatever I could try out. In 2004 I bought my first ski a Fenn Mako Millennium and coming from a flatwater background thought it was as stable as a rock! It wasn't as fast as a flatwater K1 but much more versatile and the self-rescue part is nice.

The late summer and fall of 05 saw the first V10's appear at our races. When local paddlers started getting theirs, guys who used to be on boats a little too tippy for them turned out to be be solid paddlers and moved up significantly in the finish order. The added stability of these new generation skis looked like it was directly transferable to speed for pretty well all of the paddlers.

Over the winter of 06 I was lucky enough to borrow a V10 to train in and get in a race near the end of that period. I loved the single foot well as this was what I was used to in ICF kayaks, I could rotate better and felt a stronger connection to the hull though my feet from catch to exit. The seat was also more comfortable for my butt. The hull stability was very evident and I could motor through slop that would have slowed me up in the Millennium. My only concern was that for me, I saw a big HR increase between 12 to 14 km/hr in the V10 that I didn't get in the Millennium. I felt that I couldn't get the same glide coming off the exit as I was wanted. As many of our races are in that speed range I stuck with the Millennium. That being said V10s and Huki S1-Xs were almost the only boats you'd see in many surfski race in our area. A few flatwater trained paddlers still had Millenniums but the majority of paddlers had moved to more stable hulls and the quality of racing increased dramatically.

By the fall of 06 I made a choice on the Fenn Mako 6. After almost six months in the Mako 6 I feel I can suggest the hulls are very similar. They both have improved paddling ergonomics for someone who paddles using foot and leg drive to initiate the torso rotation and the stability is noticeably better than the Millennium. I would say the V10 is more stable and the Mako 6 slightly easier than the Millennium. If you can paddle an ICF K1 you'll be fine in either. If you found the Millennium a little tippy the V10 may be more your style. Below 12 km/hr pretty well identical, in that crucial (for me) 12-14 km/hr range I like the glide of the Mako 6 better in the flatter water. In really rough or big water, I can't comment.

Comparing the Mako 6 to the Millennium, I like the Mako 6 across the board. Relearning the leg drive and rotation from a single footwell too a little while but it improved the glide and reduced the effort needed to move at a given sub-max speed. I haven't done enough race pace or intensity with GPS (too dark to read it most mornings or evenings right now!) to know about faster paces. Surfing, the Mako 6 responds better in our water. I had more surfing runs in the first three weeks with the Mako 6 than 2 years in the Millennium. Admittedly I am still learning to surf, bu the extra rocker and slightly flatter stern made a huge difference in the short period waves.

Hope that helps, please keep in mind these observations are based on my experiences in our local conditions.

In the end, I agree with robuser- go with availability and support first.

Alan

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17 years 4 months ago #133 by HI Paddler
Alan, the topic of the thread was quite interesting to me, as I'm considering what to purchase as well. Anyway you could translate from French to English (my French stinks)?

Thanks!

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17 years 4 months ago #134 by AlanC
I've added an English version to the text below

Alan

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17 years 4 months ago #135 by Frog on ice
Salut Fabien
Things could be worst, you could be like me a poor frenchman stranded on the icy pacific shores of british columbia, canada:)
After years of white water and ocean kayaking, I recently purchased a V10 Sport standard (fiberglass). After a few paddles in sheltered (i.e. flat) waters, here are a few early impressions.
Very high quality finish (with the exception of the stickers which are`already peeling off, not a big deal).
The seat is very comfortable, it might be a bit wide for me once I venture out on the more bumpy stuff, we'll see.
The single adjustable footwell is allright, but I would have prefered individual footwells like the ones in my friend's Huki as they feel more "solid".
As I only swam on my first outing (always an unpleasant proposition around here), I would say that it is a fairly stable ski.
Going into the wind, the nose is quite sensitive to any crosswind, but since my friend experiences the same thing on his Huki it is probably not a V10 specific thing. Anyway, these are made to paddle downwind and surf so...
From a purely subjective point of view, my V10 "feels" faster than the Huki S1R I have tried.
Hope you find these limited bits of info useful.
Are there any surfski dealers in france or do you have to go diretly through the makers? I am sure that it is just a matter of time before this sport catches on big time in southern europe. Importing skis over there might be an interesting business. I hope one day to paddle my V10 in the warm homewaters of le Bassin d'Arcachon!
Salut, a la prochaine




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17 years 1 week ago #136 by [email protected]
Fabien, I feel your pain. Ipaddled the Mako for years andw as very sad when Fenn stopped making them. It is a great boat. The Mako6 is very similar to the Mako and my biggest impression on the Mako6 is that is moves very smoothly. If you paddled a Mako before I would go with a Mako6.

However, if possible, it is best to try some demo boats before buying.

Happy paddling
Dawid

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