Whats Fastest ski for flatwater that ok in ocean

12 years 7 months ago - 12 years 7 months ago #8155 by AR_convert
Replied by AR_convert on topic Carbonology Atom
"This is a post from a local paddling site, I happened to be there before and after this paddlers first hit-out in the ski and also got to go for a paddle. I'll let you read his thoughts before adding mine.

"Did my first run on the Carbonology Atom trial boat today.

Was more stable than I thought, more stable than I recall my Millennium to be. Similar stability to my V10 with 20mm seat padding and small rudder, but a very different boat.

Speed is definitely there. I tried some quick turns and side on chop, I was quite comfortable.

Turns very well, feels nice and snug around my butt, hips and legs. Flare the knees a bit and you are locked in, pretty cool for a small paddler used to 'swimming' in bigger boats.

Looking over the bow, it feels like a long K1, nice narrow paddle entry too. I kept feeling twitchy thinking I was out in chop on my K1 and about to swim, but got over that quick. Low volume bow is awesome in a side wind for a light paddler. I get smashed by wind side on in the V10.

I have really short legs. The hump below my knees was a bit higher than I'd like for leg drive (not that mine is that good). However, others fit in very well. Shame the hump is not a little lower as it seems targeted to smaller paddlers. Ideally I'd pad the seat up and forward a little (ok on flat water, but risky for rough stuff). My overall position relative to the water was quite a bit lower than my V10 when stock and padded up. I had to shorten my paddle about 15-20mm.

Tried to dive the bow on some small runs. It doesn't have much volume up front and did show signs of going under a little. I am 75kg at the moment, usually a bit less. I don't think it will be a problem downwind, but certainly hope to find some runs soon to check. Others have reported concerns in this regard. Can't comment until I find heavier conditions.

Mounting was tricky. I practiced 10 or more mounts with and without paddle. I am used to a 'straddle mount' (throw leg over then drop in seat). That works if you drop straight into seat, but if you stay above seat to long you will swim. I have not practiced side mounts, but feel it is probably essential in rough weather on this boat. A few bruises from the mount practice, but important stuff. I will have to practice mounts in rougher weather too before a proper downwinder.

Overall, a very nice boat for small people like me. Perfect flat water / marathon Mol, and light chop Mol, even for those with limited stability like me. Probably good downwinder and choppy boat for light and experienced paddlers too (and those with skill to manage the bow on steep drops).

Sat is windy, not an ideal direction (offshore), but I'll find something. Tues-Wed may be the first day with reasonable downwind conditions ... will see if I can keep it until then."

Okay, now my turn, I should mention the conditions were flat where I paddled with about a 10 knot breeze blowing so no impact on the boat.

I had previously paddled the ski in January after taking the Vault for a demo, and while I loved the speed of the thing thought it way outta my league. But now that I reflect I had just had a 2-3 month break from paddling. I jumped in and within a few stokes I felt like WOW :woohoo: this is much better than I remembered. I moved out into some deeper water to reduce drag and then put the hammer down, I was pleasantly surprised that I was able to paddle at my top (let's say 10km pace) speed without feeling unstable.

I immediately thought I would love this ski for river/estuary races, as my friend above has stated, it needs to be demo'd in what Rob demo'd it in, bigger downwind/crosschop conditions, if you were planning on having it as your only ski for all seasons.

I'm not ready to move up from my Vault just yet (still improving my PB's in it) but should the opportunity arise to race it in a flat water race I'd be in for sure.

Always looking for the next boat :)
Last edit: 12 years 7 months ago by AR_convert.

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12 years 7 months ago #8234 by 920rookie
Replied by 920rookie on topic Re: Carbonology Atom
Thanks for posting my "Part 1" summary of my first paddle on the Carbonology Atom. AR_convert, or pilbaralad ... whoever you may be ...

Here's the second part of my summary for those interested. I am getting to like the Atom and am thinking about adding one to my quiver.

"Well no downwind for the Atom, but I have been out chasing some small waves (2ft with odd 3ft face).

I love the maneuverability of the Atom on a wave. I'm not sure if it is the shorter length, or the snug fit, but it seems that I can throw it around on a wave better than the V10 (remember I am a little guy at 73kg ish). This seems good when I need to change direction to pick up another wave (assume same for chasing runners if I had the chance to go downwind).

I did struggle with stability a bit, particularly when the wind came in, and I was waiting for waves. I would get the wobbles when waiting for waves looking over my shoulder, so threw the legs over as 'trainer wheels'. Not a normal 'paddle condition' but it did remind me that I would have to learn to handle the stability a bit better before taking such a boat on choppy downwinders. Once on a wave it was stable and maneuverable.

I am getting better at remounts with more practice, and have the bruises to prove it. However, it can still take me two goes to get on if choppy. I think this just needs more practice. I can't manage a side saddle mount, the seat is very deep (good once you are in it!).

I like the way the bow drops as the stern picks up a wave. This seems to drop you onto the wave faster which is pretty cool. I also found the bow would submerge on steeper drops, but it kept speed when submerged. This was a little unnerving at first. Occasionally I'd get 10mm of water over the deck to my feet (deflector required). I don't know how far under it goes before the point of no return (or slowing you down a lot). However, other paddlers of low volume and skinny nose skis seem to think that is not a problem so long as the boat stays fast when under (something to get used to).

The low volume bow seems good for paddling through the wave in front of you. It does not seem to lose as much speed and sap as much energy as larger boats I have tried to paddle through waves.

So overall, I'm happy with this Atom trial. As an intermediate paddler, I think it would be a great flat water, mild water, mild downwind and marathon boat. My surfing today suggests it would also be a good downwinder, and I would not hesitate to take it out in say 15 knots. I'm sure it can handle much more, but my skills are not ready for that yet. My main reservation being re-entry in heavier chop.

I think it is a boat worth learning to handle, but in my case I would need a back up boat for the heavy weather while the skills improve."

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12 years 7 months ago #8237 by Rightarmbad
Replied by Rightarmbad on topic Re: Carbonology Atom
I don't think that wind knottage has any real bearing on the difficulty of ocean conditions, except at the extreme end.

If the swell and the wind line up with the direction you are headed, I think anything is able to be paddled.

Follow the path of the independent thinker. Expose your ideas to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that are important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.--- Thomas J. Watson

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12 years 7 months ago #8252 by 920rookie
Replied by 920rookie on topic Re: Carbonology Atom
Yea point taken on the wind, but locally when the Freo Doctor comes in it is pretty consistent with minimal change in direction. Once in we are lucky enough to take a "Cut Run" for optimal downwind conditions. The resultant ocean conditions are pretty predictable after about an hour's blowing. Swell may change, but the wind wave is fairly predictable.

Granted, if seas and swell are in the same direction anything is able to be paddled, but I'm more thinking about if you come off ... should not happen much when in control, but most of us have a lapse of concentration some time or another and take an involuntary swim. That's when remount practice is critical. We have a short swim to shore on the "Cut Run", but nobody wants to do the swim of shame!

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12 years 6 months ago #8660 by DougMar
Replied by DougMar on topic Re: Carbonology Atom
Thanks for a nicely done, seemingly unbiased review, 920rookie. Wish I had access to a more varied collection of skis around here (Kill Devil Hills, OBX, NC, USA). About the only skis around here are one Think Uno, plenty of Epic V10's and V12's (mine), and those stellars. Would love to try an Atom for flatter water racing. I'll keep the V12 for the bumpy days.

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12 years 6 months ago #8682 by 920rookie
Replied by 920rookie on topic Re: Carbonology Atom
Thanks for the kind words Doug, I try to keep all my reviews unbiased, and reflective of my skills. No gun, just a recreational paddler who likes to test himself in the odd race amongst my paddling peers.

I ended up buying an Ex-Demo Atom, build #6 it seems by the markings. The quality of the current builds has improved since my one, but you expect a few minor issues on early builds, and I knew what I was getting. It was demo-ed a lot, traveled a lot and it had a hard life, but it survived pretty well. I had a good local repairer do his magic, and it is near new again and still very light.

I love the boat on the flat, really like it in small chop, and am still learning in the bigger stuff. I can't handle it comfortably in decent side chop yet but can keep it upright. I am probably still faster in my V10 in choppy side on stuff, as I waste energy on stabilization. However, that is just me lacking skill, I find the same when I paddle my K1 in choppy conditions where others are fine.

I am certainly starting to feel better in it. I love the low volume in a side wind, it slices through chop very well. When I relax and get my balance right, I can take things side on well too, but do lose a bit of power while I learn to balance better.

The snug seat, and height between seat and feet is just what I wanted, it feels great. Kind of like a cross between my K1 and V10 (now that's a big contrast). Bigger paddlers may find it a tight fit, but I think it feels fantastic. I 'swim' in my V10, which is not really the right boat for small guys like me.

Downwind seems fine for a 73kg paddler. My stability can be a bit marginal with some side chop downwind, but no problem once up and running. The nose can go under on bigger drops, a film of water skims over the bow, but the speed stays up so ignore it and keep going! I need to learn to manage the nose a bit better, pulling up in the troughs, or changing direction before the trough, which is better technique regardless. I am starting to throw it around a bit, it seems to change direction quite well, the snug fit and shorter length seems to help me do this. I will probably make a deck wave deflector, or maybe foot guard to better split the water before filling the foot well.

My early Atom has a single bullet scupper. I think the newer ones have two. The single scupper works very well, and sucks well from about 7.5kph, I am impressed. I don't know if I would bother with a second bullet if I had the choice. I have padded out the spare room in front of the pedals with closed cell foam to reduce footwell volume, this seems to work too.

I'm not too sure about the stock rudder. I would like to try a deeper elliptical rudder like the V10 for bigger conditions, and a more swept rudder and skeg for weed. I think that will make quite a difference for me. I tried a few different rudders on my V10 and they made quite a difference. I also just like to play around with rudders (not always a good thing).

I have also practiced remounts quite a bit, and it does take time to master remounts on this one, but I am getting there. I haven't actually come off yet paddling, but have had a few impromptu braces. I like to know I can get on in choppy stuff if I need to. I still use a paddle strap (and leg leash) so that I don't have to worry about my paddle if I need to get back in. I get on a bit like a surf board, lying down straddled, before raising up to drop into the deep seat. Then once in, with legs over the side, I reel my paddle in on the leash, then once paddle in hand, bring the feet in and get going. That seems to work for me.

All in all I am very happy with the purchase, but keeping the V10 for a bit longer while I learn to handle it. My gut feeling is that I should not need a second ski within 6 months if I keep my training up ... but I also have a problem parting with my old boats (so my wife tells me!).

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