Standards in Surfski Outfitting

This is somewhat related to the "Steering Should Never Break" thread.

What do you think should become standard outfitting/equipment across all surf ski models? Things that could be agreed upon by all builders. Recognizing that coming to a "universal standard" may be a rather difficult, if not impossible, task it seems to make sense to try a couple of small things first. Plus, some may argue that too much standardization restricts innovation. Just to start, I'd like to see these two items become standard; rudder posts and steering cable attachments.

First, I'd like a standard rudder post. Meaning a standard diameter, length, and top securing point. The rudder post tube would have a set inside diameter and hull to deck well length allowing for a quick change of rudders regardless of builder. For example: paddler A has an Epic and wants to try paddler B's Huki new style 9" weedless rudder on the Epic. Not a problem with a universal rudder post system. By limiting this standard to just the post, manufacturers will still have room for rudder blade innovation.

Second, I steal this from the bicycle industry. A standard rudder cable and end fixing points. Cable actuated rim brake cables have been standard for a very long time. They are easy to change in just a few minutes. This could be a very easy thing for ski manufacturers to adopt. The rudder post/cable fixing point, be it T-bar or other creation, could be easily modified to accept the poured/pressed end fitting found on bike brake cables. At the footplate assembly a standard fitting would provide cable clamping and length adjustment. In a simple and functional system one would be able to change a frayed or broken cable very easily.

I'm sure there are many more ideas out there, like grab handles on the bow. Let them ideas fly.

A standard size rudder shaft would be nice, but...

It would then lock you into materials dead end.
Usually, the way to make something lighter requires oversizing the structure to enable a lighter material to be used.
( Although at this stage it seems that steel is the choice for longevity and no weird breakages at sea from previous undetected damage.)
What about the so called canted rudder concept, would rule that out too.

I can see no problem with cord being used, easier for me to repair myself, a pre-terminated cable could only be done one end unless you then standardised the position of rudders and cockpit as well as overall length.
It would be more expensive and a specialised part just for our industry as opposed to a length of cord.

Yes it could be done like brakes, but I think cord is the future, not steel cable.

It just needs to be engineered correctly.

Breathers could certainly be standardised.
I'd like to see all ski's with a leash attachment.

Bikes ? Hello ? BB30 ,External Bearings ,Cartridge style, Cup and cone, Octalink ,ISIS ,Hollowtech I or II ,Square taper ISO or JIS ! Oversize head fittings /stems ! Tapered steerer tubes ! 3 different clamp size front derailleurs + braze on also! Brakes ie Single pivot , Dual pivot , U-brake ,Cantilevers ,V-brakes, cabledisc, Hydraulic disc! There is no standard system ,all made to a price/purpose IMO .

No duh, bikes are obviously way out of control. You miss the point. I'm talking about just that single little bit on the end of rim brake cables, either road or mountain, that have been in existences and use since I can remember. I can go into any bike shop and ask for a road bike brake cable and they'll know exactly what I'm talking about, sounds pretty standard to me.

These are just some ideas and are by no means carved in stone. If the canted rudder becomes popular across many manufacturers then there is no reason a standard could not be applied to that. If high strength, no stretch synthetic lines become popular then a standard end attachment system could be standardized.

The purpose is to benefit the consumer in certain areas while also allowing for innovation by builders in other areas. Not long ago I was in my local shop and they were changing out the rudder lines to Spectra on a V10 Elite. The customer has about $5000 invested in this boat and there they were monkeying around tying knots. Don't get me wrong, I have a long history of knot tying, both for work and in recreation and enjoy it. Come on, you mean to tell me that the surf ski industry can't come up with something better than that?

What is interesting about bike components too is that there used to be default standardization. I was a racer in the 1970's and 80's and we ALL used the same components, Campy. All tube sets were the same size and serious builders all used Columbus or Reynolds tube sets.

The advantage was that after a crash you could easily get a brake lever or rim or whatever from a friend and finish the weekend.

But as the high performance bike market grew so did amazing innovation in design and materials and other companies built great gear and Campy lost its market leadership. I still have my wife's old Richard Sachs team bike that is Campy Super Record with the standard 42/53 chain rings -- beautiful antique.

Tom

Tom D
I saw Richard Sachs and his work at the Handmade Bicycle Show in Portland, OR a few years ago. He's been around a long time. My cousin used to race in Connecticut during the late 70's and had one of Richard's bikes. Bet he wishes he still had it now, they are classics, very expensive and hard to get. Fantastic bikes.

We lived near Richard in CT and were friends. My wife raced for him a couple of years and he let her keep her bike when she quit. It is like new. I have my old Roberts track bike too. I keep thinking I should build a place to display them they are too nice to ride.

Hi guys,
The universal rudder housing sounds good, but the main problem might be that all, or almost all, manufacturers would need to change their molds. Rudder position along the boat is often experimented with, usually meaning the further forward the rudder goes, the thicker the boat. To have a universal tube length, some boats would need to have the housing set deep into the deck, or possibly above the deck like in the old days!

Other universal things I can think of are safety issues - like having a minimum floating capacity when holed and maybe some way of stress-testing or labelling skis.

I really like the cool grab handles on the ends of the Think boats - these should definitely be copied by all!

Other nice things might be some R+D into ways to make skis easier to carry on windy days when you`ve got your paddle too. On one of my old boats I fitted an elastic mesh to the rear deck. This was great as my paddle was held perfectly under it and into the footwells, leaving me with both hands to carry the ski.

Looking forward to hearing more innovations,

Owen

Standardisation should only be used to make things easier, not harder.

Tying a knot is easy and cheap and works well when done right.
Why add a specialised (and heavier) crimped cable?

A rudder shaft diameter could be agreed on, heights could simply be allowed for just like bicycle forks. Cut to length.

But would a manufacturer want to then do this and allow aftermarket rudder manufacturers a foot in the door?
It may be nice for us consumers not to have to spring for $150 to get a rudder replaced.
Just buy a universal rudder of the style that you want and fit yourself.

Of course all this would basically be moot if the manufacturer just does their job and has a system that works and is reliable.

If it ain't broke, it don't need fixing, but in this case, there still seem to be boats out there that are capable of stranding you with no steering.

That's not a standarisation problem, that's a design/quality control issue.
A good boat won't do that to you.

I like that Think are starting to fit handles, leash attachments and other niceties.
It shows that a high performance ski can be fitted with small things like that and still be a racing machine.

Owen,

I agree, something to make the ski a little easier to carry in high winds would be nice. If I paddled exclusively in area that were sand and grass I probably wouldn't care that much. However, I paddle in areas that are completely rock, ouch on the boat. I have a bungee behind my cockpit, similiar to the one you discussed, works Ok but something more stout would be nice. Yesterday I saw a sea kayak that had a cool looking recessed grab handle/security point behind the cockpit coaming. Something along those lines would be nice. Handles may also help those who are vertically challenged.

Rightarmbad,

Please note that the original purpose of this thread was to read other peoples ideas. At no point was the purpose to discuss why something won't work. Overly opinionated negative replys, or why something won't work, are contrary and counterproductive to the original purpose.

Simple put; I would like to read other paddlers ideas regarding things they would like to see on surfskis.

Anchor point for the leash ;
Easy system (read no tools) to change the footplate settings ;
Handles to carry the ski when it's windy (mine is easy to carry before the paddle, when I get off the water after 2 hours that's another story...) ;
Waterproof hatch for the car keys and other smal items.