Footplate angle, how to build up angle?

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10 years 9 months ago #8979 by AR_convert
I'm after some suggestions/pictures on how to build up the footplate base to get a better angle for my feet.

I find that often my heels aren't against the plate, so I need to build up the bottom so I have better contact over the whole plate.

Whatever material I use I would like to even try to mould to support my arches (like orthotics), I thought this may help with my ITB issues by keeping my legs laterally stable on leg drive instead on collapsing in at the knee.

Maybe cut out of some high density foam?

Always looking for the next boat :)

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10 years 9 months ago #8981 by Rightarmbad
I don't know the layout of your ski, but I would try and simply change the mounting angle.

Follow the path of the independent thinker. Expose your ideas to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that are important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.--- Thomas J. Watson

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10 years 9 months ago #8982 by AR_convert
Thought about that, but it would be a big job (for me and my access to a workshop and tools, anyway).

Always looking for the next boat :)

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10 years 9 months ago #8983 by fredrik
I have reduced the angle of my footplate to promote heel drive. My solution was to use minicell foam. Minicell blocks are big enough to cover the footplate in one piece. This foam has a pretty "stiff" density, it is nonslip and is easy to cut with a sharp “snap-off” Stanley blade.
I made mine 1” / 2,5 cm thick at the bottom and tapering off all the way up to the hinges, and taped it to the foot plate with a quality carpet tape (the thick end is contoured to fit the bottom shape of the footplate) So far it has stayed in place for abt 6 months with no signs of falling off.

Total time spent: 15 minutes, if you have the stuff in house

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10 years 9 months ago #8984 by AR_convert

fredrik wrote: I have reduced the angle of my footplate to promote heel drive. My solution was to use minicell foam. Minicell blocks are big enough to cover the footplate in one piece. This foam has a pretty "stiff" density, it is nonslip and is easy to cut with a sharp “snap-off” Stanley blade.
I made mine 1” / 2,5 cm thick at the bottom and tapering off all the way up to the hinges, and taped it to the foot plate with a quality carpet tape (the thick end is contoured to fit the bottom shape of the footplate) So far it has stayed in place for abt 6 months with no signs of falling off.

Total time spent: 15 minutes, if you have the stuff in house


That sounds like what I need, suggestions on where to get some from?

Always looking for the next boat :)

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10 years 9 months ago - 10 years 9 months ago #8985 by fredrik
Last edit: 10 years 9 months ago by fredrik.

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10 years 9 months ago #8986 by AR_convert
I will try a local store called Clarke rubber tomorrow, cheers.

Always looking for the next boat :)

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10 years 9 months ago #8989 by Dicko
AR, give me a call, cos I think I could make you a footplate extension moulded as you require. Inverted, moulded arch with a heel raise shouldn't be too hard. I love a bit of experimenting....especially with someone elses boat.

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10 years 6 months ago #10639 by Physio
Ask your rubber store about a thermoplastic foam, after cutting to a wedge you could heat it with a hair dryer and push your feet into, molding to the shape of your foot, comfort plus, like we do in making foot orthotics formthotics. it may be cost prohibitive though.

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10 years 6 months ago #10647 by DougMar
AR- Could it be that your plate is just a bit too far forward? During some experimentation awhile back, I brought my board further back. It felt strange at first, but my heels gained much better bearing on the board.

Also about the IT band: I was having pains in my left knee after hard sessions in the boat. I started concentrating on keeping my feet touching and knees brushing past each other as I pushed and pulled rather than splayed apart. This has cured the knee problem completely. It can be disconcerting in the multi-chop with the knees together, but ultimately I think one gains more control with this form. Though, you may already do this. Most good K1 sprinters utilize this in their technique.

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10 years 6 months ago #10649 by wesley
the footplate on all the Stellar is a more relaxed angle compared with every ski I have been in. the Fenn boats I owned had the most angled while the Stellars are at the opposite end. I had to get used to the relaxed angle which I have done. I do get feedback from paddlers who like a more angled footplate. it is hard to please everyone.

Wesley Echols
SurfskiRacing.com
#1 in Surfski Reviews.

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10 years 6 months ago #10651 by DougMar
I've noticed that in boats with a more angled plate (top raked forward more), my bare feet tend to slip upwards when pumping. In fact, with the E-V12-U, I've had good success in reducing the angle of the plate by 10 degrees (more vertically mounted with the addition of wedged shims). A non-slip coating on the board would also help prevent the feet from slipping forward/upward. As Wesley indicated though, everyone is different.

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10 years 6 months ago #10683 by AR_convert

Doug at SagaKayak.com wrote: AR- Could it be that your plate is just a bit too far forward? During some experimentation awhile back, I brought my board further back. It felt strange at first, but my heels gained much better bearing on the board.

Also about the IT band: I started concentrating on keeping my feet touching and knees brushing past each other as I pushed and pulled rather than splayed apart.


In the 12 months with this ski I have experimented with footplate length, foam padding to lift my hips up and hence away from the sides of the bucket, and recently used my foot orthotics taped to the footplate.

Between new improved orthotics for running and cycling and using my old orthotics in my ski i seem to have beaten the ITB curse. I ditched the foam padding and in a 30km ski race I did just recently I felt great and pulled up very well. I know my knees are tracking well in as I ended up with chafing on the insides of them.

I have just returned to running after 9 months off due to the ITB problems and am excited for the upcoming adventure racing season, the break from running has paid dividends for my paddling now just gotta keep the improvement going while rebuilding the running form.

On another note I had some one on one coaching and video Assesment last weekend which showed the rear of the ski slew from side to side, upon inspection of my feet it was determined that my feet (size 46) are too big for the footplate and even with the pedals tilted forward of the footplate the balls of my feet rest above the footplate on the base of the pedals inducing unwanted steering input even when concentrating on driving with the heels!

Thanks for all the ideas and offers of help!

Always looking for the next boat :)
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10 years 6 months ago - 10 years 6 months ago #10724 by DougMar
AR: yes, my balls (of the feet, size 46) are on the pedals in the V12 as well. I've not had any cyclic steering problems since making the pedals approximately parallel with the plate, or even angled more forward of the plate's plane. I believe, at least for my anatomy, that a more upright foot plate allows one (me) to push harder with the heels without the feet slipping upward or the balls to needlessly push on the pedals, though when needed good pedal control is available. Another bonus to the more upright position of the foot plate is the ability to pull with more effect on the strap. Edit: AR, sorry, just re-read your post. You're doing everything that I'm doing, and you're still having problems. I'm guessing that you are concentrating on your pull as well. Maybe you should try to remount the pedals so that their faces are a few mm forward of the plate's face so that your balls do not inadvertently touch the pedals needlessly. Could it be your orthotics pushing on the pedals?
Last edit: 10 years 6 months ago by DougMar.

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10 years 6 months ago #10734 by Rightarmbad
I suffer from the same too big feet problem, but my self centering mod fixed the wandering tail.

I've also noticed that the white pivot axle for my Epic pedals is really wearing fast from having to take all of the pressure.
As are the pedals themselves.

That's enough motivation for me to do the lift the plate up mod.
I may try tipping the plate back a little at the same time

I was warned off doing this by Greg Barton as he said that the plate relied on the floor for support, but I see no problems reported by others and I will put some closed cell foam in behind it to help support and also take up the inch or so of space away from the heavy water passenger.

I so wish manufacturers would simply angle the rails upwards toward the front to help out us bigger guys.
I'm sure that smallies must suffer the other side of the coin and not be able to reach the pedals as well.

Come on guys, this is an easy fix at manufacture to help out a huge amount of people.
If the plate needs support, then simply run a raised edge up the middle of the footwell to match.

Follow the path of the independent thinker. Expose your ideas to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that are important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.--- Thomas J. Watson

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7 years 7 months ago #23567 by Richie
AR - are you still using orthoditics in the boat with success? I am suffering same sort of ITB/ Glut pain with flat feet and think it worth a go. Have an angle wedge but think that the knee is still rotating in on strong leg drive.

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7 years 7 months ago - 7 years 7 months ago #23568 by AR_convert
Hi Richie, sorry to hear you have this too.

Almost 3 years down the track and I have heard many paddlers tell that they also have IT band issues generally related to their hips.

While I did get back to running, as soon as I tried longer (10+ km) or more intense training the ITB syndrome kicked back in, so I made the decision to give up competitive running and hence solo AR.

The silver lining to that cloud is that I have now progressed to Division 1 in paddling and still get to adventure race with teams as the specialist paddler.

I don't bother with the orthotics in the boat anymore however I still believe if I was predominantly ski paddling (now 50/50 ski and K1) I would go back top using them in the ski due to the leg drive I use in the ski. In a K1 the position is such that I dont find my feet collapsing in and putting pressure on my ITB's.

Good luck with finding a solution to your issue.

Always looking for the next boat :)
Last edit: 7 years 7 months ago by AR_convert.
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7 years 7 months ago #23574 by Dicko
Richie,

All the orthotic is doing is providing a wedge under your heel that prevents your sub talar joint in your ankle from rolling in. Because this joints axis is at an angle this rolling causes your legs to internally rotate.

When you're walking, the way the rolling in occurs requires an orthotic. A simple wedge under your heel can actually increase the amount, and speed of rolling in. However on a foot rest I would think a simple wedge would do.

Before I did that though, I would fiddle with the leg length. Try shortening your pedals a notch or 2. If your legs a too straight this would put more strain on your hammies, ITB etc. I used to get groin pain if my legs were too straight.
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