V8 to V14 to SEL

Hi folks,
So as some of you might remember, I paddled a V8 (my first ski) for my first year and in year 2 decided that I wanted something more challenging so I decided to throw caution to the wind and get a V14.

This brings us to year 3. I sold my V14 this spring in search of something a little less needy of my attention. By the end of last season, I could paddle the V14 without swimming on flat water for 5-6miles. My avg speed was about 7mph so not shabby but nothing to write home about. I sold that ski because I really wanted to enjoy my time on it and it just felt like work. I was more mentally tired at the end of the paddle then physical.

Enter the SEL. Thanks to Wesley Echols, I now have his 2G SEL in the excel layup (26lbs). First, I should say that the ski is well manufactured. The fit and finish is good from bow to stern.

The seating position is good and the seat is comfortable (I just fit in the V14). I like that the seat slopes away in the back just a little which keeps waistbands from rubbing as you rotate. The width is great because I have enough room for my hips, yet the ski narrows quickly so that my thighs make good contact throughout the stroke. The hump is lower than on my epic which is really nice for full leg drive and good rotation. I will say that the bucket feels a little deep which only matters when I am getting in a out where I like to let my legs hang over the sides.

The dual bullet venturi drains work amazing well and require minimal speed to get them going. They also come with plugs which will come in handy this winter.

The footplate is rock solid, however, I will say that adjusting it can be a pain in the ass. The lever lock system they using gets sticky and can jam, however since I only paddle by myself, this isn't an issue.

Now for paddling it. Primary stability is there but the ski feels very loose when you first get in it. It does twitch like the V14 but without the impending doom feeling. However, as others have pointed out the secondary stability is great. You can really lean it over and feel the boat push back. This makes for a great training ski. I know many people say stability before ability and I don't disagree however I could have horrendous for on my V8 and would never know because the ski does give any feedback. The looseness of the SEL gives enough roll to let you know when you are of balance (bad leg drive timing, late exit, to much rotation, etc), however if you really screw up, the secondary stability gives you enough time to recover without needing a big brace which pretty much stops you. I've been out half a dozen times on the ski and got caught in some pretty sloppy river wind conditions last week full of side and confused chop up to about 18". I would have never made it in the V14 but with some determination, made it 5miles without a swim.

As for speed, I must say that I was expecting it to be faster given some of the reviews. Now I'm not saying it's slow by any means, but it doesn't feel like the V14. It doesn't feel slippery. It feels like a narrow faster ski. Now to be fair, I have a weedless surf rudder on it so I need to cut it down or get a flat water rudder. I have been GPSing some of my outings and am at least .6mph faster than I was on my V8 however it has been really windy around here lately and that's messing with my averages (making them slower). Well, that's it for now. Hoping to get some GoPro shots here in the near future so stay tuned.

Its been interesting following your ski evolution. I also just went a similar direction. I picked up a Gen 0 V10 (old design before the painted bows) knowing that it would be above my ability, but it was such a good deal I couldnt turn it down. I paddled that over the winter (in a dry suit) and got out about 15 times in it, all in mostly flat river water. I fell in all but 4 maybe, and I too was mentally tired at the end of an hour paddle just from thinking about staying in the boat. (I now realize from Wale's length x width thread that the Gen 0 was only 17.08" or 43cm, which I think makes it a borderline elite boat. Gee, that might explain my wet winter. I think the new V10 at 17.7" would be almost manageable for me)

Similar to you (but in a more stable boat sorta way) I picked up a Stellar SR G1 and just got out for my first paddle yesterday. The SR is so stable, I almost feel I want more feedback from the boat. The primary is so solid, I miss some of the twitch that forces you to improve your balance, and keep your form correct. In my case, its probably good, as I have no previous double blade experience, so I need to beat the muscle memory of a good stroke into myself before I move up to a tippier boat. I think I'll end up in an SEI or possibly V10 Sport in a year or 2, maybe straight to a new V10 or SEL depending on how a test paddle feels.

Also, I agree, my SR has very nice build quality. I have only 2 complaints and they have been mostly addressed on the G2 boats: 1: the bucket area is huuuuuuuuuge. I bet you can fit 10 gallons (40L) of water in there! I am going to make an expanding foam plug behind my foot rest to fill some volume. Seriously, I cant believe how big it is. 2: the catch is fairly wide, and the bow flares noticeably faster than some other intermediate boats. It kept me from nose diving quite effectively, but when going into waves it did bow slap a little.

Anyways, I enjoy reading your updates, as I am on a similar path, but a year or 2 behind you experience wise. I'd be interested to hear what you think about the SEL after taking it out in some larger waves or rough conditions.

Cheers

I am going to make an expanding foam plug behind my foot rest to fill some volume.

I made a composite box for in front of the foot plate of my old SEL to reduce some of the water volume ... build process here if you're interested:
www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.101526...&type=1&l=41bef55d47

I thought about a V10S and SEI but figured I make the larger jump. I'm going to keep my V8. It is my total crap weather, cold water with ice chunks, don't want to fall in boat. I never paddled my V14 in the winter. I wear a 3/2 wetsuit with booties would rather sweat than freeze. I thought about a drysuit however since I paddle flat water the vast majority of the time I could justify the expense.

You are correct though. I love having a ski that gives you input. Compared to the SEL, the V8 feels like and overprotective mom. It keeps you from getting hurt and tells you that you are doing great even if you look like $%#!

With regard to adjusting the footplate, do you push the cam's down when you unlock them. There is a noticeable click and then the adjustment is fairly easy. I found the 2g to be more unstable than the 1g SEL. Also the leg length in the 2g was simply to short for me.
What I like most about the SEL is the fact that I know I can remount it. Prior to the SEL I had a Fenn Elite SL and before that a Fenn Elite. Stability was never really an issue. But the fact that they were so damn hard to remount did my head in.
My wife has had an SEL for 5-6 years and I've paddled it 2 or 3 times. After struggling one day in the SL I took her ski for a paddle and it was like a light bulb moment.
I have a 1g ultra now and for the first time in a long time can keep up with my mates. It is not as fast as a carbon elite S but it's not far behind. At least I'm in the same postcode when we paddle now.
The seating position took me a while to get used to, but it feels normal now.
The lack of rocker is noticeable getting on to small runs but as it gets bigger the boat just gets better and better.
Remounting is easy and as I get older and heavier that is a factor that needs to be considered.
This ski has made paddling fun again.

kwolfe wrote: ....... the V8 feels like and overprotective mom. It keeps you from getting hurt and tells you that you are doing great even if you look like $%#!

Gold!

Just an update after having had a more time on the SEL. I am now pretty darn comfortable in the ski. Once you get used to the initial looseness, you realize that it really takes a pretty good error to get you wet. My average speeds are climbing but what I m really finding great is the feedback the ski gives me.

I have realized that allot of my instability is coming from mistimed leg drives. I more frequently am still driving after the paddle exits which is throwing me off center, so that has been a point of focus. It also ensures that my leg has good contact with the ski which makes paddle in the chop easier.

I also just picked up a maxpaddle Jtech and paddle for the first time with it yesterday. For those of you who don't know, it's supposed to be a lot like the Jantex Gamma. It is going to take some getting used to. The catch is very smooth, however unlike my Epic Mid, it lets you know when your not doing something right. The paddle either wants to pop out of the water too soon or can get caught and want to pull under the boat. Either way, good top hand control, and body rotation are both need. Also, getting your paddle planted with the correct feather angle is crucial. Fun paddle though.

So just to get one thing straight, the fact that the paddle dives and spits out early is a good thing as opposed to a well balanced paddle that does not do that?
Why did you then go to a more stable ski, surly by your reasoning the ski is too benign and you need to be struggling to give you feedback?

Ranga,
Maybe I wasn't clear. When paddling the V14, I was on arguably the most unstable ski currently made. Mistakes were punished by a swim. The SEL is still not an intermediate ski however with its initial looseness by greater secondary stability, I can get good feedback from the ski when I am not balanced, however I still have ample time to recover.

As for the paddle, I never said that diving and spitting out was a good thing. What I very specifically said was that the paddle gives you very good feedback regarding the accuracy and consistency of your stroke. When I got into a good rhythm, The paddle was a pleasure to use and easier on the muscles. However I found it less forgiving to mistakes that my mid wing.

Just wanted to give a follow up. This morning I decided to take out the V8 just for kicks. I can now say that the SEL is about .3 to .4 mph faster over a 5 mile workout.

In comparison, the bucket on the V8 is shallower which is nice getting in and out, however I do like the SEL better. I feel better connected to the ski. Also, the hump on the V8 is longer so I find my calves touch the hump before the back of my knees does which limits my leg drive a bit. On the SEL, I sit a little more forward and because of the hump design I find I can really extend my leg and get better rotation.

The V14 had a snug and very comfy buck for sure. Not sure if I like the SEL better, it was just different. As for speed, I'm sure that if I could put the power down in the V14 that I can in the SEL, I would probably be .2 mph faster in the V14. The glide of that ski was just amazing so over a longer distance, I never felt that physically tired. More mentally from maintaining balance.

On a final note, I have been switching between my Maxpaddle Jtech and Epic mid wing. I have to say, I (a guy who's been paddling for 2.5 seasons) find myself liking the Epic better for a couple reasons. First, I do like the oval shaft since I can get consistent feedback on how the paddle is indexed. Also, the blade shape is more forgiving to small changes in paddle angle and rotation. Not to mention, if you ever need to turn quickly or back the ski up (I'm flat water remember), its easier to manipulate in the water.

This isn't to say the high twist blade is bad. The catch is great and if I can get into a good rhythm, I can maintain the same speed as the mid but with seemingly less effort. The problem I have is when the shaft rotates slightly in my hand, the paddle does release as well which slows the ski down. Also, if I bury the paddle too deep, I find it harder to exit than the mid. However, when you get it right (picture hitting a gold ball well), it does feel great.

That's it for now folks. Hope this helps someone.