V12 - Anchor point for leash

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13 years 1 month ago #6914 by Geofff
I was recently out in some rather large conditions doing a downwind run and started to surf a particularly big wave which was just about to break (I didn't notice it was about to break until it was too late). The wave was just too steep for me and the nose buried and the ski went end over. The ski pulled me underwater via the leash for what seemed like an eternity and when I eventually popped back up (I was wearing a PFD) I noticed that the leash had pulled the foot strap from its anchor point on the foot board.

The leash was only just attached to the foot strap as I had put the loop in-between the velcro to keep it in the middle. I was incredibly lucky as the footstrap must have broken just when my weight pulled the surfski off the wave. Had it broken any earlier, I have no doubt that the leash would have come totally off the footstrap and the ski would probably have continued to surf the 2 miles to shore without me. (for any Hawaiian's I was coming back from Bird Sh#t Rock)

I contacted my local epic dealer who very quickly provided me with another footstrap free of charge (the ski is only 4 months old). He asked me to have a look at where the footstrap is attached to the rudder board as there is supposed to be a small plate which spreads the load to prevent this sort of thing happening. I noticed that this plate was not screwed in tight as the screw was hitting the rail which the rudder board slides along. Consequently this meant that the two screws were taking all the weight and this resulted in the webbing of the footstrap being torn through.

The point in this hard to understand post is:
a. Why don't all ski manufacturers design a purpose built leash attachment (similar to Huki design)
b. If you own a V12 - make sure to check that the rails are not preventing the footstrap being properly secured. With a bit more force the screws can be fully tightened however it does restrict the adjustment of the rudderboard a bit.

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13 years 1 month ago #6919 by owenfromwales
It`s good to see some of the boats with well designed anchor points for the leash. I`m still stuck using my spec ski, which means that the leash has to attach to the weaker footstraps.
I really like the ideas championed by Didier Plouhinic in Brittany: www.surfski.info/getting-started/tips-ot...-their-surfskis.html
and Magnus De Brito with his Point 65 Bourbon Orca:
www.surfski.info/latest-news/item/1281-p...ca-design-notes.html
This system is especially helpful if you do get it wrong in (big) breaking surf!

189cm 90~100kg
Present skis:
2017 Stellar SEI 2G
1993 Gaisford Spec Ski
1980s Pratt Spec Ski
1980s UK Surf Skis Ocean Razor
Previous
1980s UK Surf Skis Ocean Razor X 3
1987 Kevlar Chalupsky (Hummel) (Welsh copy!)
1988 Kevlar Double Chalupsky
1992 Hammerhead spec
2000 Fenn copy

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13 years 1 month ago #6920 by Hiro
Leash anchored anywhere near the center of the ski = recipe for maximum traction on your leash/anchor point/knee.
You're lucky the footstrap was the first to break, it might have been your knee !
Didier Plouhinec and Point65 solutions are the way to go if you paddle in big surf.

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13 years 1 month ago #6966 by zachhandler
I was just out paddling and the footplate on my v12 came loose on one side. two screws had worked their way loose. I bought new screws (10-32), cut them to size and replaced them. I did use some locktite on the threads. I also pulled all the other screws and added locktite before putting them back.


I would advise everyone to check for loose screws periodically.

Current Skis: Epic v10 g3, NK 670 double, NK exrcize, Kai Wa’a Vega, Carbonology Feather, Think Jet, Knysna Sonic X
Former Skis: Epic V12 g2, Epic V12 g1, Epic v10 double, Nelo 550 g2, Fenn Elite S, Custom Kayaks Synergy

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13 years 1 month ago - 13 years 1 month ago #6970 by AR_convert
My wife keeps telling me I have a screw loose but I'll be damned if I can find it :blink:


Doesn't hurt to be reminded, I have had the same thing happen with a V10sport, but I imagine any ski could suffer the same issue. Just glad I picked up my loose footplate screws while on dry land. Stories of rudder failure, footplate failure etc remind us to do a check if these things so we are not left floundering offshore in big swell :dry:

Always looking for the next boat :)
Last edit: 13 years 1 month ago by AR_convert.

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13 years 1 month ago #6973 by mckengmsurfski
I go through with a screwdriver and periodically (once a month or so) check the screws on my skis. Like AR's wife, I have found one loose from time to time.
I also make a point of taking off the rudder cover and checking the yolk and lines after every paddle. Takes about 10 seconds to do and could save some big headaches, or worse, next time out.

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13 years 1 month ago - 13 years 1 month ago #6976 by Rightarmbad

I bought new screws (10-32), cut them to size and replaced them.



Do you realise that they will rust where you cut them?

Follow the path of the independent thinker. Expose your ideas to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that are important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.--- Thomas J. Watson
Last edit: 13 years 1 month ago by Rightarmbad.

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13 years 1 month ago #6978 by zachhandler
The original stainless screws were also cut/ground down to the proper length (~4mm). No rust there. Maybe you are thinking of galvanized steel? I think if you cut SS with a torch in can rust as you melt out the protective chromium and nickel and change the composition of steel near the cut. You can also get superficial rust from a non-stainless saw rubbing off on the stainless metal.

Current Skis: Epic v10 g3, NK 670 double, NK exrcize, Kai Wa’a Vega, Carbonology Feather, Think Jet, Knysna Sonic X
Former Skis: Epic V12 g2, Epic V12 g1, Epic v10 double, Nelo 550 g2, Fenn Elite S, Custom Kayaks Synergy

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13 years 1 month ago #6981 by Rightarmbad
Just google passivating stainless steel.
Any time stainless has been worked, it needs passivating.

Follow the path of the independent thinker. Expose your ideas to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that are important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.--- Thomas J. Watson

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13 years 1 month ago #6983 by zachhandler
Interesting. I'll have to check the screws for rusting. Fortunately I'm about 2000 miles from salt water...

Current Skis: Epic v10 g3, NK 670 double, NK exrcize, Kai Wa’a Vega, Carbonology Feather, Think Jet, Knysna Sonic X
Former Skis: Epic V12 g2, Epic V12 g1, Epic v10 double, Nelo 550 g2, Fenn Elite S, Custom Kayaks Synergy

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13 years 1 month ago #6984 by Rightarmbad
In that case you will probably be fine.

Follow the path of the independent thinker. Expose your ideas to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that are important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.--- Thomas J. Watson

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  • SS@Bermuda7
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13 years 1 month ago #6985 by SS@Bermuda7
Replied by SS@Bermuda7 on topic Re:V12 - Anchor point for leash
nothing fortunate about that:)

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13 years 1 month ago #6986 by Hiro
would some varnish or paint over the cut protect the screws from rust ? I need to replace some screws on my foot plate...

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  • andrew skeoch
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13 years 3 weeks ago #7017 by andrew skeoch
Replied by andrew skeoch on topic Re:V12 - Anchor point for leash
Thanks
I'll check that. Must say i joined the SUP side for the past few months. Though it is great cross training, and i do like it, i gotta say i love my V12. First downwind yesterday and we were screaming like girls. Sitting in the v12 just feels awesome nevermind once you get moving and blow other away.
V12!!

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13 years 3 weeks ago #7040 by duncangroenewald
You should be fine if you cut the screws with a hacksaw, this is not really working the steel so little or no change in the composition will occur. Just don't let it overheat while cutting - so cut slowly or keep cool with water or cutting fluid.

More importantly make sure you use the correct grade of stainless steel screws - not all stainless steel is suitable for salt water. Ideally you want to stick with 316 or 316L for marine or pool (chlorine) environments and inside people (artificial hips) as others are more susceptible to stress corrosion cracking - which you will not pick up until the screw sheers off completely.

I have had stainless steel windsurfing harnesses fail catastrophically - the 5mm stainless steel hook snaps clean off like a dry twig with no warning only to discover they were not made from marine grade stainless steel.

Usually if you buy stainless steel from a marine supplier it will be marine grade - but the usual hardware store supplies will likely be 304 which you may want to avoid. I am a bit out of touch with all this so you might want to contact a marine engineering firm to check that I have the grades correct.

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13 years 3 weeks ago #7041 by duncangroenewald
I just got a V12 a couple of weeks ago - can anyone tell me whether the attachment point in the middle of the cockpit (or whatever its called) is for a paddle leash or for attaching the ski to the paddler ?

My experience in large surf or open ocean (e.g. Miller Run) is that its a pretty big hit when a growler goes over you and that little attachment point looks like it will rip out very easily.

For now I am using the footstrap as the main attachment point - any thoughts on what the best spot is ? I will send a note to Epic themselves to get their opinion.

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13 years 3 weeks ago #7042 by mckengmsurfski
Didn't know that Epic skis had a dedicated leash attachment point. I own 2 of their skis and neither has one. Must be a new addition to their skis... I've always attached the leash to the foot strap on my V12.

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13 years 3 weeks ago #7043 by Rightarmbad
I hope your not thinking of the bailer handle........


An attachment point must be a new thing to Epic, and good on em if they have.
I attach mine to the rail that mounts the sliding footboard. I put my GPS on the footstrap.

Follow the path of the independent thinker. Expose your ideas to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that are important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.--- Thomas J. Watson

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13 years 3 weeks ago #7045 by Rightarmbad
Update; I saw a brand new V10 sport today and guess what, it had a V8 style leash mounting point.

Guess it may be an upgrade across the range.

I wonder if it is able to be retrofitted or if there is a strengthening around it on the new ones.

Follow the path of the independent thinker. Expose your ideas to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that are important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.--- Thomas J. Watson

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13 years 3 weeks ago #7046 by latman
I agree in theory with the 316 vs 304 statement ,but in my experience some 304 never stains but some 316 does ? , the 316 self tapping screws I buy from my local supplier started rusting 5 or so years ago as I believe their supplier sourced them elsewhere (probably china $$$)

as to the leash attachment there should be a metal plate or washer/nut on the backside of the laminate or the bolt/screw holding it down will rip straight through IMO.

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