New Epic V10 - generation 4

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1 year 1 month ago #40330 by [email protected]
So... I spotted this video being promoted on Facebook:



It's the launch video for Epic's latest version of the V10.

I've always had a soft spot for the V10 - it truly changed the surfski world - and it changed my paddling life. The V10 popped up in 2005. The first boats were built in Durban, South Africa.

At the time I had moved from my first old second hand Wedge, to a new Cape Town built Brian's Kayaks Molokai. Then for the very first surfski world cup, held here in Cape Town, Custom Kayaks built 4 of their ICON skis for the New Zealand team - and I picked up one of them after the event at a discount.

I battled to learn to paddle it, enjoying it occasionally in downwind conditions, but struggling even after 18months (and a Cape Point Challenge) in choppy water. I swear it was the tippiest ski on the planet.

And then, for the second half of our local racing season, Richard Kohler lent me his battered old demo V10. I paddled that thing for 3 months and loved every minute of it. Here was something much more stable, that I felt bullet-proof in, no matter the conditions. It went downwind like an angel but was still fast on the flat.

I was bleak when I handed it back. I paddled my ICON one last time, returning to the beach after 100m, swearing never to paddle it again. For various complicated reasons, though, I ended up with Fenn Mako6, which they'd brought out rapidly in order to compete with the V10.

I did buy the second generation V10, after having paddled it in Mauritius, but in our local conditions (the Miller's Run generally features short, steep runs) I battled to catch waves with it. I seem to remember it had a very slim tail that tended not to lift with the wave behind, leaving you to have to paddle your guts out to accelerate onto the run.

So I sold that one...

It wasn't until 2019, that I got the chance to paddle the V10 3g in Perth during a memorable "snapper run" in perfect downwind conditions, in a gap between the WA Surfski Week races. I loved it.

And now the 4th generation of this iconic boat has been released... There's one coming to South Africa in the next few weeks that'll have my name on it, and I can't wait.

There are one or two of the latest V12s here in Cape Town, and those who've paddled it, rave about it. I took it for short spin on a rough day and found it a little too spicy for my aging balance... Mmmm..., I thought, if this was only a little more stable...

Well, from what I understand, this boat is exactly that. Like a slightly tamed V12.

Anyone had a go on it yet?

Share your impressions?!

I just made my New Year's resolution... or at any rate a declaration of intent. My Personal Best for the Miller's Run is 43:10. I'm going to beat that in my 60th year on the V10 4g.

Rob

Currently Fenn Swordfish S, Epic V10 Double.
Previously: Think Evo II, Carbonology Zest, Fenn Swordfish, Epic V10, Fenn Elite, Red7 Surf70 Pro, Epic V10 Sport, Genius Blu, Kayak Centre Zeplin, Fenn Mako6, Custom Kayaks ICON, Brian's Kayaks Molokai, Brian's Kayaks Wedge and several others...

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1 year 1 month ago #40336 by Epicpaddler
Looks like a great boat. I agree, the latest v12 is a bit twitchy for me. Even my g3v10 can be a bit much (for me) in an unstable cross chop. Downwind it flies and it moves upwind efficiently. The new bow profile looks like it slices through waves easily and pops up if you burry it into the wave in front. Don't know if it's enough difference to upgrade from the g3, but i'm sure it will be a popular boat.

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1 year 1 month ago #40337 by waverider
Dealers are demoing these in Aus atm. Its a tad wider than the g3 so easier to step up to from V9 I think, bypassing the sport. More rocker

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1 year 1 month ago #40338 by [email protected]
Had a couple of messages from folks who've paddled it:

"Gday Rob, I’ve paddled both V10s , the new Gen4 is an extra cm wider and is more stable , but is faster and more dynamic in the downwind"

""Yes, it’s a baby v12 - super nice. Stable for those miller runs..."

Ah well... I always get super-excited for a boat like this... I hope it lives up to the promise. Recent Epics have been really comfortable; the V10 3g seemed to be a cracking downwind boat; the V12 3g has been getting some rave reviews from guys here. So if they've really managed to cross the V10 with the V12...

Rob

Currently Fenn Swordfish S, Epic V10 Double.
Previously: Think Evo II, Carbonology Zest, Fenn Swordfish, Epic V10, Fenn Elite, Red7 Surf70 Pro, Epic V10 Sport, Genius Blu, Kayak Centre Zeplin, Fenn Mako6, Custom Kayaks ICON, Brian's Kayaks Molokai, Brian's Kayaks Wedge and several others...

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1 year 1 month ago #40341 by tve
Replied by tve on topic New Epic V10 - generation 4
The V10g4 is starting to become a problem for me... I have a V10g3 and my wallet is twitching... I haven't paddled the Miller's but I suspect that that's exactly the conditions for it.

I've been paddling a V12g3 for the past 1-1/2 years and really, really love it. But when it's cold, big, and I'm out there alone I've recently used the V10g3 for that little extra margin of safety. In smaller conditions the difference is minimal if one is not racing and for non-pro's the V10 may actually be faster due to fewer missed full-power strokes.

But the day before the V10g4 announcement I took the V10 out in really nice tall & steep conditions and ... was really frustrated. The nose is really a deal-breaker compared to the V12. Every time I was trying to get onto the fast stuff I had to push over a smaller wave ahead or punch through some mess coming from the side. I'd paddle hard and was sure to be on it from my V12 feeling, except, as soon as the nose went a little under water that was the end of it. I really felt like "wait, what happened, how is it possible that I missed it?". When I push the V12 nose into a wave it's almost as if didn't happen, the V10g3 in contrast hits the brakes. Of course, this is exactly what the gen 4 supposedly fixes... I'll be curious to read about your experience!

There's also the fact that in high winds it takes a ton of effort to turn the V10 upwind if I need to circle back or otherwise have to go upwind, and I've often given up. The V12 has never been a problem in that respect (but of course the tippyness is an issue).

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1 year 1 month ago #40354 by CrabStick
That does look very promising and nice to see Epic again putting more emphasis on downwind suitability with the increased rocker. It seems not long since the g3 came out but they obviously felt there were some improvements to be made and may have had in mind the competition from the Vega flex which I believe is selling well. In Australia and South Africa the closest competitor would be the Swordfish and it is notable that the changes from the g3 V10 to the g4 are perhaps taking it closer in shape to the Swordy: more rocker, narrower (or less volume) in the nose, and length down to 6.1m ( = 20' as stated by GB in the video).

CrabStick, Perth Western Australia
Current Boats: Epic V9 ultra, Fenn Swordfish S, Fenn Spark S
Previous: Think Eze, Stellar SR, Carbonology Boost LV, Fenn BlueFin S

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1 year 1 month ago #40356 by [email protected]
There's container coming from Epic to South Africa, expected in July, that will have a couple of the new V10s in it... and one of them has my name on it. I can't wait.

And I'm very much liking the "less tippy V12" message.

Tve's post above refers!

Rob

Currently Fenn Swordfish S, Epic V10 Double.
Previously: Think Evo II, Carbonology Zest, Fenn Swordfish, Epic V10, Fenn Elite, Red7 Surf70 Pro, Epic V10 Sport, Genius Blu, Kayak Centre Zeplin, Fenn Mako6, Custom Kayaks ICON, Brian's Kayaks Molokai, Brian's Kayaks Wedge and several others...

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1 year 1 month ago #40357 by [email protected]
And another video about the v4:


Rob

Currently Fenn Swordfish S, Epic V10 Double.
Previously: Think Evo II, Carbonology Zest, Fenn Swordfish, Epic V10, Fenn Elite, Red7 Surf70 Pro, Epic V10 Sport, Genius Blu, Kayak Centre Zeplin, Fenn Mako6, Custom Kayaks ICON, Brian's Kayaks Molokai, Brian's Kayaks Wedge and several others...

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1 year 4 weeks ago #40376 by Glider
Replied by Glider on topic New Epic V10 - generation 4
Hi Rob,

I would be very interested in your choice of the V10G4 over the Fennix Swordfish given your vast experience on the Swordy and presumably access to the fenn(ix) skis.
Maybe just for a change?
Cheers

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1 year 4 weeks ago #40377 by [email protected]
Open cards - I'm being sponsored a boat by Epic. My stated goal is to beat my Miller's Run PB on it - and I'll be writing about that from the perspective of it being my 60th year this year - I turn 60 in May.

Having said that, if I didn't think I was going to like it, I wouldn't have accepted it! I'm going to be committed to it - so it had better be good!

I love my Swordfish but I have always disliked the seat. I paddle the pre-Fennex Swordfish at the moment and use a butt-pad because I find the seat so uncomfortable. The Fennix SF-S has a very upright back to the seat which makes it uncomfortable for me to lean back - which I find is necessary when going down steep runs, to keep the nose up.

Some folks say that the upright back helps them not to slouch and to keep an upright stance - I disagree with that.

No boat is perfect - but I'm hoping the messages about the new V10 being a V12 for mere mortals (as opposed to elite paddlers!) are true.

The V10 1g changed my paddling life, but I went for the Fenn equivalent at the time - the Mako6 - for various reasons.
I owned a V10 2g, but it wasn't the best downwind boat for our conditions.
I paddled the V10 3g in Perth in 2019 and loved it - but that was literally only one downwind (Snapper Run).
I've tried the V12 but find it too tippy to be comfortable in rough conditions.
I like the V9, but would prefer something a little more responsive.

Something common to all the updated Epics is that I find the seat very comfortable - a big consideration.

Most of my paddling buddies are on Fennix SF S - so it'll be obvious if the V10 gives me any advantage!

Rob

Currently Fenn Swordfish S, Epic V10 Double.
Previously: Think Evo II, Carbonology Zest, Fenn Swordfish, Epic V10, Fenn Elite, Red7 Surf70 Pro, Epic V10 Sport, Genius Blu, Kayak Centre Zeplin, Fenn Mako6, Custom Kayaks ICON, Brian's Kayaks Molokai, Brian's Kayaks Wedge and several others...

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1 year 4 weeks ago #40378 by tve
Replied by tve on topic New Epic V10 - generation 4
Interesting that you don't go for a V12 to beat your PB... I find that in a big DW I prefer the V12 over the V10 (V12g3 vs. V10g3, ignoring the nose difference here) because it's just as stable as far as I'm concerned, but it has higher rails which means you can jump a wave and end up in messy stuff with less swamping, and it has a higher seating position, which means more power to catch that wave or climb over something. Yup, the moment you stop to wait for your buddy it's a totally different ballgame, but you're not gonna do that if you want to beat your PB, right?

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1 year 4 weeks ago #40379 by Glider
Replied by Glider on topic New Epic V10 - generation 4
Hi Rob,
That sounds like the best reason for a change in ski. I would not argue with that. It will certainly be a great comparison with your mates.
Good luck with he PB.

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1 year 4 weeks ago #40380 by [email protected]

Interesting that you don't go for a V12 to beat your PB... I find that in a big DW I prefer the V12 over the V10 (V12g3 vs. V10g3, ignoring the nose difference here) because it's just as stable as far as I'm concerned, but it has higher rails which means you can jump a wave and end up in messy stuff with less swamping, and it has a higher seating position, which means more power to catch that wave or climb over something. Yup, the moment you stop to wait for your buddy it's a totally different ballgame, but you're not gonna do that if you want to beat your PB, right?

I think you're a whole lot less tippy than me! I stopped paddling my Fenn Elite years ago - and all my PBs came in the more stable boats.

When I tried the V12, I felt way too tippy to be able to apply full power... For me, stability definitely outweighs potential speed. Having said that - I do miss the way elite boats glide and allow you to pop over the next wave...

But I'm hoping the new V10 will have improved glide/wave-popping-over capabilities along with the stability!

Rob

Currently Fenn Swordfish S, Epic V10 Double.
Previously: Think Evo II, Carbonology Zest, Fenn Swordfish, Epic V10, Fenn Elite, Red7 Surf70 Pro, Epic V10 Sport, Genius Blu, Kayak Centre Zeplin, Fenn Mako6, Custom Kayaks ICON, Brian's Kayaks Molokai, Brian's Kayaks Wedge and several others...

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1 year 3 weeks ago #40382 by Epicpaddler
Can't wait to hear your reviews. I have a g3 v10 and love it, but it does stuff the bow sometimes. At least when it does, it doesn't track off in one direction the way my v8pro used to.

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1 year 3 weeks ago #40383 by CrabStick
Agree - really looking forward to reviews from Rob and others. No doubt Mark Sundin will add to the enthusiasm.
Epic's website lists the capacity as 135kg which is even more than the V9 at 120kg so it could be implied that it is a fairly high volume boat. For me (73kg) the V9 behaves like it has more than enough volume, so....this is really a roundabout way of saying to Epic that they need to crack on with development of the next V10L! Many of us smaller downwinders would love to see a drop in the length and increased rocker on it too.

CrabStick, Perth Western Australia
Current Boats: Epic V9 ultra, Fenn Swordfish S, Fenn Spark S
Previous: Think Eze, Stellar SR, Carbonology Boost LV, Fenn BlueFin S

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1 year 3 weeks ago #40384 by tve
Replied by tve on topic New Epic V10 - generation 4
The V12 is listed at 130kg max. I weight 75kg and feel totally happy in it. You could give it a try and challenge yourself ;-). But what I really wanted to say is that I'm not sure you can conclude how well a boat works for lighter paddlers from the max rating. That being said, the V10g3 bucket is pretty wide for skinny paddlers, we'll see how the gen4 is...

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1 year 3 weeks ago #40387 by CrabStick
You're right that I may be drawing a long bow with that logic and I appreciate that the V9's lower max. rating is influenced by it's shorter length.
I still live in hope that the choices for low volume intermediate downwind boats will expand and that a new V10L will be part of the line up.
I'm now in danger of getting off topic but the low volume and insane secondary stability of my fenn Spark S are wonderful attributes and straight downwind it's a blast but it is demanding and tiring for me in all other (non-flat) conditions. This makes it a great training tool.
I'd love to try a V12 but can't imagine it would ever be a relaxing paddle.

Anyway, back to the g4 V10.....

CrabStick, Perth Western Australia
Current Boats: Epic V9 ultra, Fenn Swordfish S, Fenn Spark S
Previous: Think Eze, Stellar SR, Carbonology Boost LV, Fenn BlueFin S

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11 months 3 weeks ago #40494 by [email protected]
Anyone been playing with V10 4g in the last four weeks?

Mine should be arriving within the next 2 weeks or so.

We're in the depths of winter so we're mostly doing "reverse Miller's Runs" which tend to be less challenging than the full-on Miller's Run, but should still enable some proper testing of the boat's feel downwind.

Some old photos of the very first V10s, manufactured here in SA, popped up on my feed the other day. They were raving about the incredible lightness of the boats, which were coming in at around 17kg! Back in the day, that was impressive.

The surfski industry has come a long way :-)

Rob

Currently Fenn Swordfish S, Epic V10 Double.
Previously: Think Evo II, Carbonology Zest, Fenn Swordfish, Epic V10, Fenn Elite, Red7 Surf70 Pro, Epic V10 Sport, Genius Blu, Kayak Centre Zeplin, Fenn Mako6, Custom Kayaks ICON, Brian's Kayaks Molokai, Brian's Kayaks Wedge and several others...

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11 months 2 weeks ago #40498 by Glider
Replied by Glider on topic New Epic V10 - generation 4
I see the Epic website mentions that the seat width is similar to the gen 3 seat. From memory this is a couple of cms wider that that V11. Could anyone confirm this?
Rgds
glider

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11 months 2 weeks ago #40499 by [email protected]
Width of the V10 gen 4 is 46cm. The width of the V11 is 43cm.

Just took delivery of a V10 4g... But the weather is "inclement" today, which means that the wind is blowing in the wrong direction...

I suspect I'll have my first go in it tomorrow on flat water (yuk) and hopefully in downwind conditions on Sunday.

Can't wait!

One of my buddies paddled his for the first time in downwind conditions yesterday... and is raving about the stability, the performance on the runs...

Rob

Currently Fenn Swordfish S, Epic V10 Double.
Previously: Think Evo II, Carbonology Zest, Fenn Swordfish, Epic V10, Fenn Elite, Red7 Surf70 Pro, Epic V10 Sport, Genius Blu, Kayak Centre Zeplin, Fenn Mako6, Custom Kayaks ICON, Brian's Kayaks Molokai, Brian's Kayaks Wedge and several others...

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